Will you continue in Rugby?

[SimonSmith]

I'm not sure it will be the tackle issue that would make me walk away, but a piece of what it represents.

I think the Community game, in many countries, is getting fucked over by the NGBs and WR. They're concerned with the Elite game as a Product, and what they can do with that money. The amount of concern for the Community game as an entity and as a foundational base for the game is being disregarded.

One of the articles I read about this explained how a lot of the concern about concussion was at the Elite level - but when they were consulted, they didn't want any changes and asked for it to be pushed on to the Community game. In no serious business would that kind of decision making stand up to scrutiny. THis is either about safety, or it isn't, and safety is ubiquitous, not just at our lower levels.

In more countries, the governance model is one where the Community game is left to fund and run itself and the NGB concentrates on Elite end. It's fucking up USA R, it's doing the same in Australia, and it will continue.

I grow more disillusioned with the game as time passes. I don't care about the actual tackle height. I do care a lot about how the change management process was handled, and will continue to be handled, and how that represents how the NGBs and WR regard the ordinary user.

 

[Volun-selected]

I will maintain for a very long time that changes in the ruck/breakdown application of law has had a detrimental effect on the game.

Well the old way was certainly effective at encouraging players to get off the floor.

 

[Dickie E]

I will maintain for a very long time that changes in the ruck/breakdown application of law has had a detrimental effect on the game.

I think it works pretty well if refereed correctly. AIUI the powers that be want the ball carrier to run the ball confident that they will retain possession 90% of the time. Less than this, and the ball carrying team will have a propensity to kick. More than this, and the defenders have no opportunity for turnover.

 

[Rich_NL]

Why on earth wouldn't you?
what you going to do instead - take up snowboarding on grass, or crocheting, or macrame? (not that there uis anything intrinsically wrong with any of those fine pursuits etc)

How about this for the "rugby's gone soft" crowd?

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cmx2xeAB1mX/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=

 

[crossref]

New Zealand go for sternum

Looks like they have developed a better communication plan than the RFU did !

https://www.boprugby.co.nz/newsarticle/121836?newsfeedId=1220239

 

[crossref]

Scotland consulting

https://scottishrugby.org/scottish-rugby-begins-community-consultation-on-tackle-height/

 

[didds]

New Zealand go for sternum

Looks like they have developed a better communication plan than the RFU did !

https://www.boprugby.co.nz/newsarticle/121836?newsfeedId=1220239

The bar was very low though.... ;-)

 

[crossref]

The bar was very low though.... ;-)

what a disastrous year for the RFU
- two premiership clubs go bankrupt, one of those still looking well dodgy
- CEO gets mauled and humiliated at parliamentary select committee
- absolute dogs dinner of a mess over tackle height
- new clubs' union calling for everyone's heads.

Bill Sweeney, the CEO, earns £600k

 

[didds]

what a disastrous year for the RFU
- two premiership clubs go bankrupt, one of those still looking well dodgy
- CEO gets mauled and humiliated at parliamentary select committee
- absolute dogs dinner of a mess over tackle height
- new clubs' union calling for everyone's heads.

Bill Sweeney, the CEO, earns £600k

unprecedented ... I cant think of a single UK institution that has had a similar appalling year with equivalent financial idiocy ...

;-) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

 

[Phil E]

New Zealand go for sternum

How many people can tell me exactly where the sternum is without checking?
How many people can see where the bottom of it is in a dynamic situation?
Maybe players should have this printed on their shirts?

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

How many people can tell me exactly where the sternum is without checking?
How many people can see where the bottom of it is in a dynamic situation?
Maybe players should have this printed on their shirts?

View attachment 4535


View attachment 4536

In your case it's about 7' from the ground.

 

[Locke]

One interesting note on NZ’s regulations as presented in the linked page, the sternum requirement only applies to the “first tackler”. A “second tackler” can still go up to the shoulders. I can’t quite think my way through any second tackler is safer to go higher. Because first tackler has probable slowed momentum so there’s less force involved?


1. Reduced tackle height to below the sternum targeting the belly area for all community rugby grades

The first tackler must tackle below the sternum and target the belly area. The second tackler can legally tackle below the shoulders in accordance with current rugby law - click here for details.

 

[didds]

How many people can tell me exactly where the sternum is without checking?

Going by "popular" SM rants about the tackle jeight stuff, about as many as can identify where the waist is.

Seems many seem to think it MUST be the knees and WILL thus lead to many many more consussions, whilst others think its the hips and more bony impacts and consussions are due.

As opposed to being closer to a belly button height...

 

[Locke]

One interesting note on NZ’s regulations as presented in the linked page, the sternum requirement only applies to the “first tackler”. A “second tackler” can still go up to the shoulders. I can’t quite think my way through any second tackler is safer to go higher. Because first tackler has probable slowed momentum so there’s less force involved?


1. Reduced tackle height to below the sternum targeting the belly area for all community rugby grades

The first tackler must tackle below the sternum and target the belly area. The second tackler can legally tackle below the shoulders in accordance with current rugby law - click here for details.

Additional context from the page, see attached photo

 

[crossref]

How many people can tell me exactly where the sternum is without checking?
How many people can see where the bottom of it is in a dynamic situation?
Maybe players should have this printed on their shirts?

the NZ diagrams show it as level with the bottom of the sleeves .. might be helpful

(although could be a case of the NZRFU not knowing its sternum from its elbow)

 

[didds]

the NZ diagrams show it as level with the bottom of the sleeves .. might be helpful

(although could be a case of the NZRFU not knowing its sternum from its elbow)

so teams now wear shirts with longer sleeves so the tackle height drops even further leading to increased oppotrtunity to offload....

so WR then legislate for maximum and minimum lengths of sleeves...

and thousands of global community clubs with shirts now less than 6 months old find their shirts are illegal...
so they have to buy whole new sets of kit possibly...
and refs now have to measure every player's shirt sleeve lengths and vsually check throughout the game with subs and blood bin returns in case a sneaky switch for a longer sleeved short has happened...
and players cannot roll their sleeves up if the want to 9eg props though that6's less of an issue nowadays with binding laws as they are)
what could POSS(IBLY go wrong ... ;-)

 

[Jz558]

I can't help thinking that measuring tackle heights by players internal organs/bone locations is potentially fraught with problems however I am eagerly anticipating Wayne Barnes' discussion with the TMO when he arges that he is mitigating a sanction down to a YC as the tackler first made contact with the duodenum before riding up to the gallbladder

 

[Stu10]

I can't help thinking that measuring tackle heights by players internal organs/bone locations is potentially fraught with problems however I am eagerly anticipating Wayne Barnes' discussion with the TMO when he arges that he is mitigating a sanction down to a YC as the tackler first made contact with the duodenum before riding up to the gallbladder

We already measure tackle height by a player's bone location, ie the shoulder

 

[Locke]

We already measure tackle height by a player's bone location, ie the shoulder

But that’s a body part that’s easily identifiable from the outside, isn’t it? How can I tell for sure where a player’s sternum is from the outside?
Using armpits seems like a natural and clear improvement to me.

 

[Stu10]

But that’s a body part that’s easily identifiable from the outside, isn’t it? How can I tell for sure where a player’s sternum is from the outside?
Using armpits seems like a natural and clear improvement to me.

You make a valid point.

Leaning into my experience with age-grade, high tackles fall into a few categories and are typically easy to see... impact to the upper chest, impact to head, grabbing shoulder(s) or seatbelt tackle. There are few tackles made at the actual height of the armpits/sternum, so you rarely find yourself trying to judge a borderline tackle.